Aggressive Postings don't solve problems

[kernowyon]

Absolutely Neal! +1

[Bald Brick]

Vortex,

You didn't come out as particularly aggressive toward your compatriot. It just sounded like a normal difference of opinion. He wanted a keyboard layout that you consider inferior (and I'm sure rightly so). You did call his preferred layout "stupid" and implied that no real Bulgarian would touch it, but before that he had called your preferred layout "unusable" and told us that nobody actually was using it.

But you solved his problem for him. (And he later gave what sounded like a perfectly valid reason for wanting the layout he wanted.)  Now, disagreeing is not being aggressive. (Not even when you know you are right.   )

[AndrzejL]

Well said Yogi...

[kernowyon]

Well said Yogi...

 

Laugh of the day! Thanks Andy

[Tony]

I fully concur with the feelings of all the Volunteers helping idiots like myself. 
Very well put by Rudge I feel:

It's frustrating when things don't work. Especially when things normally work so well.

People get spoiled, then they get mad because something doesn't work, they get lost and maybe mess up some other stuff, then they get desperate and then they post.

They don't bother with telling us what they did or what their problem is, they just post their rant about how something don't work and how they think it should.

Spiralling out of control emotionally, into panic. The number 1.) way to find yourself with an unbootable system, where you may be beyond help.
A Golden No.1) Rule: "Don't Panic" obviously should be encouraged.

I hope people don't mind some examples of a few ideas I were taught and used to help clean Windows Malware, when appropriately asked on volunteer Forums. Don't wanna dwell on the Malware aspect, rather the methodology of giving help to someone in a panic.
Actually these example sites have changed a little just in the last six months. They're a Network of people going back well over Ten years, spanning maybe 15 or more Forums. They attract DDOS attacks constantly.
Anyway it is clearly stated how to behave, on entering the Forums, and asking for help.
I do this just to show the strict, step by step manner HELP was offered.
We were all given "Canned Speeches". i.e. a copy and paste statement Welcoming, explaining the cooperation would have to be 100%. Read Forum Rules, be Polite, Reply in no less than three days.
Complications were minimised by having diagnostic programmes which generate a Log, which we were trained to spot the Malware, maybe a mispelt filename, often times requiring a lot of analysis. Took nine  months training till I was  allowed to handle 'Victims' (horrible term I feel) but true.
When the problem was found initially I would use  "Canned Speeches", with point by point instructions, requiring a courteous reply and sometimes complex action from the victim. Very robotic, so no emotion could become a factor, plus everything spelt out for a person who may never have used a Computer, to lessen error, and stress.

I may be well out of place posting  this, I'm not sure. Please excuse me if I am. It is just meant as an example, in the worst help situation, an Infection, which of course doesn't happen on Linux Systems. 
Some of the Introductory steps may help the peole here, although the appropriate 'stickys' seem to be in place on the PCLinuxOS Forum to guide help seekers'.
http://www.bleepingcomputer.com/welcome.html  (please ignore the Adds, a new thing !)
http://www.bleepingcomputer.com/forums/forum103.html

Maybe of some interest to the great volunteers here who have to devise methods of helping people with problems.
Cheers,
francis

[Vorteggs]

Vortex,     
It might be better to ask questions of the new users. They may not know that they are not giving needed information or that they are 'telling' instead of asking for help. In such cases, we must show them the better way, I believe.      

+1

[Vorteggs]

Thank you Bald Brick.

Still I think I shouldn't be aggressive and if I wanted to diminish the layout of his choice I should try the humour

[cirrus_minor]

The former have unsolvable problems

Word !!

[staceysgrrl]

Whenever I try something new and/or different and it doesn't work the way (I think) it's supposed to, my usual reaction is to sit back and wonder what I did wrong. Did I misread the instructions? Did I skip a step? 9 times out of 10, I find that the fault lies with me, not with the software.

Just my 2₵ worth.

[jimwilk]

Whenever I try something new and/or different and it doesn't work the way (I think) it's supposed to, my usual reaction is to sit back and wonder what I did wrong. Did I misread the instructions? Did I skip a step? 9 times out of 10, I find that the fault lies with me, not with the software.

Just my 2₵ worth.

As I was the originator of this thread, I must say that you have mirrored my thoughts  when I wrote it precisely. Well done.

Back when I taught mathematics to high school students, I would hear some kid say, "I don't understand this". I would encourage them to rephrase it as, "I don't understand this yet". That implies that understanding will come in the future. The former suggests that they are going to give up.

Jim

[Tony]

It is interesting to think of these things; why didn't it work ?
I like to take any 'blame' out, and just think, it is as it is. There are lots and lots of setting we come across, each requiring research, or reading a manual, it takes time. When you get it it is a real break through, then you move on, ...
At the moment I have an attitude that if anywhere it says 'Advanced', and it is not critical to go down that avenue, I don't. I've been using PCLinuxOS as Dual boot for around 3 three years, and as the sole, single operating system over six months. Till, "I get it" I'm not using Advanced settings, as I'd just be guessing. In time I'll know more and will head down the advanced path with the understanding why I am doing so.

Oftentimes comprehension is the culprit when reading instructions, and also the way the instructions are written.

In a class room, you can put your hand up and ask teacher, which in our world means coming to the Forum here. Language either written, or read, can have nuances that just happen, there's not fault or blame, it is just a matter of understanding what one person intended.

I had a instance of this recently when my family decided we would throw a computer at my 79 years young Mother, and get her online. She felt left out, especially with Email.
I came across a lot of instances where the words I used meant something different to what was intended.
For example the word 'Default'. To my Mother, it meant you had not done something, defaulted on a loan, a promise, etc.
I know it means, "The prefered", or "simplest, best working setting which should not be changed", in a situation were 'setting up' some software.
To an avid cross word enthusiast my Mother just didn't get it. Once I started thinking about it I too got confused
"The default setting is best left alone", ...   If in doubt do nothing 

[staceysgrrl]

If in doubt do nothing 

And if it ain't broke, don't fix it!

[djohnston]

I had a instance of this recently when my family decided we would throw a computer at my 79 years young Mother, ...

Whoah! I hope she ducked. 

[pags]

For example the word 'Default'. To my Mother, it meant you had not done something, defaulted on a loan, a promise, etc.
I know it means, "The prefered", or "simplest, best working setting which should not be changed", in a situation were 'setting up' some software.
To an avid cross word enthusiast my Mother just didn't get it. Once I started thinking about it I too got confused
"The default setting is best left alone", ...   If in doubt do nothing 

I think your mother "gets it".

Think about it a little more...

If you "default" on a loan, or a promise, you reneged, most likely through inaction (you didn't pay off your loan, or failed to follow through on your promise).  Likewise, if you "do nothing" (make no conscious, alternate choice with regard to settings, etc), then you get the "default" settings.

 

[Tony]

I had a instance of this recently when my family decided we would throw a computer at my 79 years young Mother, ...

Whoah! I hope she ducked.  

Yep, that's why she's 79  

1.) Wifi didn't work. 5 hours sorting that, and I do have capable siblings
2.) You never think about double-'left clicking' much. Or I don't, conundrum; what if you have arthritic hands and you can't double click ? I think that was another 2 hours after I figured it looks like she's gonna have to right click . Win XP I'm talking about. Special arthritis mouse was purchased.
3.) I wish she hadn't have ducked !    She's developed a stiff upper lip about computers, can't get a word out of her,  I just hope she's not doing Internet Banking That's the real reason behind her wanting to get online, lower bank fees. Anyone else notice when you talk about security online at 'get togethers' people leave the room ?

pags:

Likewise, if you "do nothing" (make no conscious, alternate choice with regard to settings, etc), then you get the "default" settings.

Yep, your right on the ball pags, I "Get it" - but wouldn't 'preferred' setting have been more appropriate ? Not to worry 

4.) Don't ever let on you know anything about Computers to friends or family !!