Iso download options

[cozzykim]

Hi folks,

I'm not sure if this is in the right place but;

I find myself frequently linking to the iso download page to suggest that people run a PCLOS LiveCD to a) Eliminate hardware problems with Win machines or b) encourage them to try PCLOS when they're being advised to "try Linux" by the Ubunturati.

Although the full and minime versions are great for aficionados, I think they are at extreme ends of the scale for complete newbies.

In other words, a full desktop download leaves a newb with far too many choices and the minime version has no recognizable browser or email client for a newb.

This isn't a criticism of PCLOS per se, rather a request for a newb friendly "saviour version", with minimal DL size, no unnecessary apps but with mainstream browser and email client shortcuts on the desktop.

With advent of Win8 (yecchhh ), how about a minime+ version that defaults to the netbook interface, and/or one that defaults to a W7 like desktop with familiar and friendly browser/email icons as already suggested.

Sorry if this irritates anyone, just my opinion, based on doing my best to convert the wary

Regards

Kim

P.S. I had to ROFL when the swear filter caught my reference to "another distro", I replaced the offending words with "try Linux", makes a change from the usual obscenities. 

[ghostbunny]

Hi Kim,

i think there is no need for a further iso. for a new user the full version is advised. it offers a full desktop with nearly everything a "normal" user needs and yes sometimes different programs for the same task so the users maybe find some apps from windows he already knows. If the new user really decides to install and want to use the OS one of the first things he should learn is how to use the package manager. Just my opinion so if the user knows how to deal with it there should not be a problem to uninstall the things he didn't need.

It doesn't matter if you use win or a linux system you always should learn how to use your OS. Also just my opinion.


regards
ghostbunny

[Vorteggs]

Although the full and minime versions are great for aficionados, I think they are at extreme ends of the scale for complete newbies.

About MiniMe from the download page:

KDE MiniMe Version (pclinuxos-kde-minime-2012.08.iso)
Size: 508 MB
md5sum: 889fe549a8dbdcc5fba0ecb2e23851e6
Produced by: Pinoc
User Level: Advanced

I think the most powerful version FullMonty is the most beginner friendly. May be it sounds inconsistently but only at first glance.

[russell.eberhardt]

It doesn't matter if you use win or a linux system you always should learn how to use your OS. Also just my opinion.

In an ideal world, yes.  However there are many users who just want to use an Office suite, browse the web and send and receive emails.  They want it to work and continue working without having to do anything.

Russell.

[menotu]

There are some merits in cozzykims suggestion but as ghostbunny advises I also think  the "full" release is the best option.

The KDE 2012.08. release has a lot of applications that cover most bases. And having those applications  already installed should help ease a lot of new users into the world of Linux and PCLinuxOS in particular.

But apart from that the logistics of creating and supporting other releases is very hard for the small team of "PCLinuxOS devs and backroom guys" to take on extra ISO's.

What you could do cozzykims is create your own ISO based on your own system by installing and/or removing the appropriate applications. This is fairly easy to do using MyLiveCD and from their you could burn the resulting ISO it to CD/DVD to give to your friends and colleagues. And you and friends could even use PCLinuxOS Live USB Creator again it's fairly easy to do.

[Just17]

In other words, a full desktop download leaves a newb with far too many choices and the minime version has no recognizable browser or email client for a newb.

As has been pointed out, the Mini ISOs are for advanced users, so we are left with the other.

The difficulty appears to be "too many choices" ......  and you believe the number of choices should be limited and this would make it easier for a new user.

While I understand that some of those coming from the Win side are not used to making choices, it is hardly an onerous task to decide which icon to click on to see what an application does and if they like it.

I don't believe it is logical to limit all other users of the ISO to a few applications to overcome the hesitancy of the few who are apparently afraid of choice.

If someone decided to issue an ISO especially for that kind of user, how does one decide what applications should be omitted? Would the result be any better? Would they still not fear clicking on an icon?

On the other hand there are a lot of new users who embrace the choice provided.
I was one some years ago. It was like entering Aladdin's cave!

New users come from other distributions as well as other operating systems.

So the only answer would be a 'special' ISO for those fearful of choice.

Would that be a reasonable use of limited resources --- developer's time and effort to produce and maintain such an ISO?

I think not .....  but others might have other opinions 

[cozzykim]

I can see the logic of suggesting the full monty, I always use the latest KDE full version for local installations myself.

I suppose, refining my original question, what I'm suggesting is that the desktop be tailored to look instantly friendly.

My wife has converted from Vista recently (no swear filter there eh ) to 2012.08 with no issues, but only because I was there to show her around so to speak.

I'm not usually installing locally for someone, rather pointing distant forumeers to the PCLOS download page as an alternative to the widely suggested "apparently unmentionable" distro(s).

I've tried many other distros, from RH3 onward, and can't beat PCLOS, I'm fed up with seeing Windows people on boat or car forums try other distros and come back with, "I couldn't find any of my usual programs, so I've reinstalled Win95 (or XP, or Vista) and the problem is solved now", what a waste of potential.

Regards

Kim

[Vorteggs]

While I understand that some of those coming from the Win side are not used to making choices,.... ....

chuckle-chuckle-chuckle

[cozzykim]

I'm not suggesting an app starved iso, just one that has the widely used equivalents of Win apps there, directly on the fresh desktop.

I'll name them; Firefox, Chrome, Thunderbird and Ooo/Libre are now widely used, even by Win adherents.

Either that or the netbook style interface as an option (more like Android or iOS, which newbs strangely seem to find instantly acceptable  )

I have an acquaintance who has a netbook with "Uxxx netbook edition" installed from new, which he just uses to connect to his music system and listen to Spotify.

He's had no end of problems with it, trying to upgrade by clicking on pop-up notifications, and I've had to repair it a few times when it's got messed up.

He really needs the rolling distro solution, but (without me) he'd never find it, as it isn't promoted for the netbook interface.

Perhaps the answer would be a promotional page to explain all the PCLOS options more succinctly, with FAQs for newbs to Linux in general, to demonstrate how their hardware can benefit from PCLOS in ways that it won't from another distro or indeed Win8.

Somebody will no doubt point me to such a page and embarrass me now 

 

Regards

Kim

[russell.eberhardt]

Somebody will no doubt point me to such a page and embarrass me now 

No, you'll just be asked to write it

Russell.

[agmg]

Have you checked our Knowledge Base?
It contains many information about PCLinuxOS.

Also there is an ongoing project for the PCLinuxOS Magazine with the general title "Migrating from Windows".
This project will consist of a series of articles that will (hopefully) help users coming from Windows to find their way around.

The discussion about this article is here.
You could drop by and share your opinion and/or some of your experiences with new Linux users.
This will provide valuable help to the people involved.

Thanks!

[sling-shot]

[cozzykim]

KDE itself has a beautiful netbook interface. Please check that out.

(I do not remember exactly how to switch, but it is there in Customize Your Desktop.

[cozzykim]

[cozzykim]

KDE itself has a beautiful netbook interface. Please check that out.

(I do not remember exactly how to switch, but it is there in Customize Your Desktop.

Yes I know, that's why I suggested it as a possibility 

I showed my wife how she could switch interface styles with just a couple of clicks on her new installation.

I think that the stumbling block to trying any new OS is the perception in the mind of the newb.

If you give someone aniPhone, they'll use it, give them an Android tablet, they'll use it, give them a Mac, they'll use it.

I've found out that "give them PCLOS, they'll use it" also works and sidesteps the great efforts of the agmg project, (only initially as they get used to the idea, then the interested ones will come looking for the documentation).

IOW, if you have a page with a picture of a desktop with Firefox, Chrome and recognisable "office" app shortcuts, they'll be far more likely to download and try it than if they're not familiar with the pictures they're seeing.
A shortcut with a gmail app could be another draw.

This isn't the same as giving someone an actual machine to play with, as it requires a leap of faith to download, burn and boot an unfamiliar OS.

I'll revamp my original suggestion, how about including familiar application links prominently on the full monty desktop, along with the network wizard.

Once a newb has got started surfing, emailing and facebooking they'll probably be feeling comfortable and happy to explore further.

Regards

Kim

[ghostbunny]

IOW, if you have a page with a picture of a desktop with Firefox, Chrome and recognisable "office" app shortcuts, they'll be far more likely to download and try it than if they're not familiar with the pictures they're seeing.
A shortcut with a gmail app could be another draw.

but if you are really knew and just use the default MS apps like Internet explorer, MS office... on windows how shall a pic with firefox, LibreOffice, Thunderbird Icons become familiar to you?

[Vorteggs]

IOW, if you have a page with a picture of a desktop with Firefox, Chrome and recognisable "office" app shortcuts,

May be even a short introducing video?

This isn't the same as giving someone an actual machine to play with, as it requires a leap of faith to download, burn and boot an unfamiliar OS.

I can imagine a virtual or online PCLOS session