Author Topic: Can't decide - can you help?  (Read 2754 times)

Offline Keith Logan

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Re: Can't decide - can you help?
« Reply #30 on: August 22, 2012, 12:52:11 AM »
Zolar1,

A couple of points you raised at the start,

1) Is it better to use one memory stick or two?
Well I don't know how current this is but it used to be said that two sticks could be read virtually in parallel thus making access faster than one.

2) How long can you expect capacitors to last?
I was forced to retire through ill health around twelve years ago but over the previous thirty years capacitors were continually improving. Those in the photo you provided looked like "solid alluminium" rather than the higher quality "tantalum". But two points worth noting are that the former were improving and cutting the difference sharply, second I suspect you will be toiling to find the latter on any commercial motherboards these days unless they have found a way to package them in a way friendly to auto inserting components.

Keith,
the happy chappy

Offline zolar1

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Re: Can't decide - can you help?
« Reply #31 on: August 22, 2012, 08:40:45 AM »
Thanks Keith.

If memory is really good now, then why are they advertising dual and triple channel memory?

Interesting thought - I noticed that multi core CPU's all share the same memory. How come none of them have their own memory, separate and apart from the other cores?

Offline pags

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Re: Can't decide - can you help?
« Reply #32 on: August 22, 2012, 10:35:31 AM »
Thanks Keith.

If memory is really good now, then why are they advertising dual and triple channel memory?

Interesting thought - I noticed that multi core CPU's all share the same memory. How come none of them have their own memory, separate and apart from the other cores?

The dual- and triple-channel memory designs are part of the overall improvements that are being made in memory technologies.  IIRC, DDR3 spec actually presents up to three RAM sticks to be accessed in parallel, providing some of the additional performance increase.  It's been a long time since I looked at mainboards in any detail...it used to be that only the server stuff supported the full DDR3 spec...I would expect that has changed to include more general consumer oriented boards, now...

Regrading the multi-core CPUs and accessing memory...that is a design (feature? limitation?), because all the cores must share the same data-bus (there are plugged into the same socket).  In order to isolate CPU and memory access, you would need a multi-CU board (more than one CPU socket on the mainboard).  While, technically, mutli-CPU designs are superior (and, more complex) to multi-core, the latter has become the de-facto standard, mostly due to economies of scale (they sell more, they make more, they become cheaper to make and hence, more profitable).  It's also (again, for the consumer oriented market) the simpler implementation.  Truly effective mulit-CPU designs require parallel programming, which is still more difficult that traditional serial (multi-threading -- processes, not cores -- makes a big difference, and the best improvement on the desktop is having separate processes running on distinct cores...processes that can spawn additional "threads" will get an even better performance boost, but true parallel processing is still in the realm of super-computers mostly).

Offline zolar1

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Re: Can't decide - can you help?
« Reply #33 on: August 22, 2012, 11:54:39 AM »
Thanks pags.

I wonder though. Is there any way to force additional threads to be used for any given program?

An example would be something cpu intensive like video graphics?

Offline gseaman

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Re: Can't decide - can you help?
« Reply #34 on: August 22, 2012, 12:08:22 PM »
Thanks pags.

I wonder though. Is there any way to force additional threads to be used for any given program?

An example would be something cpu intensive like video graphics?

That is the job for kernel, graphic library and graphic driver developers. For most situations, their solutions are the best available. Sometimes, adding patches to the kernel or switching graphic drivers will make things much better. Mostly, though, things continue to improve with each new kernel. Versions 3.5 and 3.6 seem to be making daily progress in using the graphic card gpu's more effectively.

Galen

Offline zolar1

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Re: Can't decide - can you help?
« Reply #35 on: August 22, 2012, 01:26:38 PM »
gseaman I read that Linux is more supportive of nVidia graphics cards.

Still not sure I want to build another one or just buy one.

Offline horusfalcon

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Re: Can't decide - can you help?
« Reply #36 on: September 01, 2012, 01:17:12 AM »
gseaman I read that Linux is more supportive of nVidia graphics cards.

Still not sure I want to build another one or just buy one.

Pardon if I just jump in here.  nVidia graphics are well supported in Linux, as are ATI/AMD and Intel.  Of the first two, I tend to favor nVidia over ATI/AMD, but that's changing - AMD is doing some really neat things lately.  In actual practice, I own more Intel video hardware than anything else (unless we're talkin' antiques here - I still have cards made by Cirrus, Chips & Technologies, Diamond, and S3 laying around somewhere...)  I tend to build for reliability.

As far as build vs. buy, economics is now in favor of buy, so if money's tight, that's the way to go.  That said, nothing beats the satisfaction of knowing every nut, bolt and screw on your hardware, and that comes with a good build.  When I buy computers, I generally wind up inside the guts inside of the warranty period, anyway, but I still buy more than I build nowadays, and I advocate the use of refurbished hardware - sure, it's a generation or two behind, but it's cheap, generally proven to perform well when carefully selected, and durable, especially refurbished workstations (I tend to favor the Dell Precision Workstation line for refurbs).

One thing,though:  I don't buy refurbs with much of an eye toward upgrading more than maybe a hard drive.  RAM for workstations tends to be the more expensive "server" stuff (ECC Registered RAM), and I usually just buy (or trade for) a machine with enough RAM already installed.

If you decide to build, do your research.  The field is constantly changing, and new stuff is coming out all the time.  A really snazzy case may be passed up by an even better design that you might like more if you keep looking.  Read reviews, and tweak your BS filter up a notch or two when you do.

You're right on with your earlier comment on power supplies.  I've lately favored Antec supplies as being very conservatively rated, but Compucase HEC and Thermaltake are good units, too.  PC Power & Cooling was recently acquired by the OCZ Technology group, and that's probably a good thing - they generally produce the Cadillac of power supply units, but all things for a price, effendi.

Good luck in your endeavors, whichever way you decide to go.

Later On,
D
"The Way is not a matter of knowing or not knowing.  One word to a wise man; one lash to a bright horse."

Dell Latitude D620, PCLinuxOS 2012.08 KDE4/LXDE, 3.2.18.pclos.bfs, specs here.

Offline RadOH

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Re: Can't decide - can you help?
« Reply #37 on: September 23, 2012, 02:58:44 PM »
After a year off the net, I took Old Polack's build ideal . . . Thank You Old Polack  ;D
xigmatk asgard pro atx (lots of room + AIR)case
corsair 8gb (x2 4gb) vgbblu 03 1600im c (32 max)memory
amd fx 4100 black ed (4x) cpu
thermaltake tr500 500w atx  (6 sata 3 molar) psu
gigabyte ga-970a-ud3 am3 atx ( unlimited growth) MB
3 case fans 120m's, 2 ide to sata adp's (room for more 7 total)
fans and ide/sata adaptors were extra
used all my other hardware and this box will rock for a long time....
vido card, Belkin wireless usb, dvd/cd burner and hard drives
optical mouse and key board.

Did I say, Thank You Old Polack . . .  ;D

cost - $ 284.40
And Here I R.... ;) pclos 2012.8 outtathebox on line


« Last Edit: September 23, 2012, 03:12:33 PM by RadOH »

Offline Old-Polack

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Re: Can't decide - can you help?
« Reply #38 on: September 23, 2012, 09:43:17 PM »
After a year off the net, I took Old Polack's build ideal . . . Thank You Old Polack  ;D
xigmatk asgard pro atx (lots of room + AIR)case
corsair 8gb (x2 4gb) vgbblu 03 1600im c (32 max)memory
amd fx 4100 black ed (4x) cpu
thermaltake tr500 500w atx  (6 sata 3 molar) psu
gigabyte ga-970a-ud3 am3 atx ( unlimited growth) MB
3 case fans 120m's, 2 ide to sata adp's (room for more 7 total)
fans and ide/sata adaptors were extra
used all my other hardware and this box will rock for a long time....
vido card, Belkin wireless usb, dvd/cd burner and hard drives
optical mouse and key board.

Did I say, Thank You Old Polack . . .  ;D

cost - $ 284.40
And Here I R.... ;) pclos 2012.8 outtathebox on line


Last week I ran across an nVidia GeForce 9600 GT PCIe video card for my friend's build, for $29.99, so bought that. I'm running it right now. (had to test it, ya know)  ;D

His computer is now complete, and I'm liking that video card so much I'm going to get another one for myself, for my backup unit.
Old-Polack

Of what use be there for joy, if not for the sharing thereof?



Lest we forget...